Author Topic: The STEM scam  (Read 1899 times)

I D Shukhov

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The STEM scam
« on: August 27, 2015, 06:10:08 AM »
You can google on "STEM scam" and find similar rants.

Science:   How many people are going to get a PhD?  In a research lab anything less means a menial lab assistant job.  There may be a few industrial jobs, but you are going to be competing with the legions of other B.S. and M.S. degree holders who are fighting over whatever manufacturing support jobs are left.

Technology:  I think this means IT.  Take a number and stand in line.  You'll be competing with H-1Bs,  would-be scientists and Ivy-leaguer code camp graduates.  You can sign up for a community college program, but the classes for the skills du jour will be fully enrolled and have wait lists.  You should also know that your salary will be stagnant for the rest of your career.

Engineering:   We don't make things here any longer.  Because of American exceptionalism we are smarter than the rest of the world, but inexplicably other countries are doing their own engineering now.

Math:  The Occupational Handbook reports that in 2012 3,500 new mathematician jobs were created:  a "much faster than average" increase of 23% (800 jobs) from 2011.

It's like a nationwide push to open up youth baseball clinics everywhere and encourage Little League participation to make the Major Leagues better.

Suggestion for the government:  Try changing economic policies instead.   Devalue the currency like however China does it.  Change tax laws to encourage domestic manufacturing.  Make it harder for other countries to compete with companies based here.  Basically, just do whatever the Asian countries do.
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The Gorn

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #1 on: August 27, 2015, 09:57:50 AM »
It's like a nationwide push to open up youth baseball clinics everywhere and encourage Little League participation to make the Major Leagues better.

I think this is a terrific analogy. Care if I rip it off sometime in a blog?
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I D Shukhov

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #2 on: August 27, 2015, 11:01:52 AM »
It's like a nationwide push to open up youth baseball clinics everywhere and encourage Little League participation to make the Major Leagues better.

I think this is a terrific analogy. Care if I rip it off sometime in a blog?
Sure.
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ilconsiglliere

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2015, 09:09:28 AM »
You can google on "STEM scam" and find similar rants.

Science:   How many people are going to get a PhD?  In a research lab anything less means a menial lab assistant job.  There may be a few industrial jobs, but you are going to be competing with the legions of other B.S. and M.S. degree holders who are fighting over whatever manufacturing support jobs are left.

Technology:  I think this means IT.  Take a number and stand in line.  You'll be competing with H-1Bs,  would-be scientists and Ivy-leaguer code camp graduates.  You can sign up for a community college program, but the classes for the skills du jour will be fully enrolled and have wait lists.  You should also know that your salary will be stagnant for the rest of your career.

Engineering:   We don't make things here any longer.  Because of American exceptionalism we are smarter than the rest of the world, but inexplicably other countries are doing their own engineering now.

Math:  The Occupational Handbook reports that in 2012 3,500 new mathematician jobs were created:  a "much faster than average" increase of 23% (800 jobs) from 2011.

It's like a nationwide push to open up youth baseball clinics everywhere and encourage Little League participation to make the Major Leagues better.

Suggestion for the government:  Try changing economic policies instead.   Devalue the currency like however China does it.  Change tax laws to encourage domestic manufacturing.  Make it harder for other countries to compete with companies based here.  Basically, just do whatever the Asian countries do.

Everything you wrote is dead on. The US does not have an industrial policy unlike Germany and Japan. These countries actually sit down and say we want to be leaders in ABC and tell industry to go do it. And they do.

The fundamental problem is that the country is cored out on multiple levels and is continuing to be cored out. Almost all the manufacturing is long gone except for defense related work. Once that was done they went after the white collar workers. The IT people were the most visible sign of this but they have gone after accounting, finance and HR as well.

But than we have the grand finale - lets continue to bring more and more people into the country while the number of jobs decreases.

I D Shukhov

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2015, 11:18:01 AM »

The fundamental problem is that the country is cored out on multiple levels and is continuing to be cored out. Almost all the manufacturing is long gone except for defense related work. Once that was done they went after the white collar workers. The IT people were the most visible sign of this but they have gone after accounting, finance and HR as well.

But than we have the grand finale - lets continue to bring more and more people into the country while the number of jobs decreases.

It *almost* makes me want to vote for Trump, but IMO the bad outweighs the good.  Maybe someone else will turn up I can vote for -- on either side.

Be Prepared.

The Gorn

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2015, 11:55:34 AM »
This country is so "cored out" (love that phrase) that the dirtbags in my area probably have to offshore their meth production.
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I D Shukhov

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #6 on: August 28, 2015, 02:47:03 PM »
This country is so "cored out" (love that phrase) that the dirtbags in my area probably have to offshore their meth production.
If the meth heads could just get interested in calculus, that would help the country a lot.   :D
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The Gorn

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #7 on: August 28, 2015, 06:13:43 PM »
The thing about meth production is, it doesn't really foster any skills that are used or valued by any industry.  Unless you count the ad hoc clandestine production of dangerous compounds in leftover bleach bottles and milk jugs using pseudophedrine pills, HEET gas line antifreeze, carburetor starter fluid, red phosphorus, and lye.

I'll just stick with sniffing laser toner liquid.
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TechTalk

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #8 on: September 01, 2015, 04:04:27 PM »
Quote
The thing about meth production is, it doesn't really foster any skills that are used or valued by any industry.

I believe you are talking about the Shake N' Bake method of producing meth because most street meth is produced in Mexico. Unless a person has the opportunity to work with an organic chemist for a period of time (e.g. Jesse working under Walter White), I am pretty sure that you need to be relatively smart in order to produce a much higher quality of meth using other methods of production.

Anyway, I believe what forum member I D Shukhov was referring to was the effect that street meth MIGHT have on people. I know that the so-called study pill known as Adderall can help people to focus on very dry or boring subject matter simply because I have taken a couple pills before. Maybe "better focus" and "find more interesting" are two completely different things, however, those were the two effects that I personally experienced. Note: I have no clue if street meth can have this type of effect on people.

Code Refugee

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #9 on: September 02, 2015, 08:26:26 AM »
Were you guys aware that meth is actually legally sold in the US and prescribed for ADHD in kids?

It's interesting since apparently the meth mouth, rapid aging, and the sores are due to the poor quality of the street meth which is heavy on toxic chemical residue. Pharmaceutical grade meth legally sold at WalGreens under the brand name Desoxyn doesn't do that stuff to you. It's still addictive, causes brain damage and aggressive behavior over long term use though.

It's actually more effective than Ritalin, but Ritalin is preferred due to the stigma of the name of the chemical. Both have the same effect on the brain, and both have the same long term effects. Meth lasts longer though so you don't have to take the pill as often.

The Gorn

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #10 on: September 02, 2015, 08:33:16 AM »
^ Better living through chemistry.  :P

I've read that the meth mouth sores and dental decay were due to the effect of meth to badly dehydrate the user, and they breath through their mouth anyway, drying out the mouth and promoting bacterial decay action.
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I D Shukhov

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #11 on: September 02, 2015, 09:33:50 AM »
Quote
The thing about meth production is, it doesn't really foster any skills that are used or valued by any industry.

I believe you are talking about the Shake N' Bake method of producing meth because most street meth is produced in Mexico. Unless a person has the opportunity to work with an organic chemist for a period of time (e.g. Jesse working under Walter White), I am pretty sure that you need to be relatively smart in order to produce a much higher quality of meth using other methods of production.

Anyway, I believe what forum member I D Shukhov was referring to was the effect that street meth MIGHT have on people. I know that the so-called study pill known as Adderall can help people to focus on very dry or boring subject matter simply because I have taken a couple pills before. Maybe "better focus" and "find more interesting" are two completely different things, however, those were the two effects that I personally experienced. Note: I have no clue if street meth can have this type of effect on people.

This guy actually has a "methamphetamine" tag on some of this posts and some of them discuss the synthesis:http://unemployedchemist.com/tag/methamphetamine/.  I don't think he's spilling any secrets...

He's a legitimate chemist who says he's a government contractor.   The guy only has a B.S. degree but really seems to love chemistry and it shows (to an extent) that love of a field might make up for academic credentials -- in terms of having a satisfying life.  He's got plenty of interesting posts that have nothing to do with making drugs.

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JoFrance

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #12 on: September 03, 2015, 03:47:18 PM »

The fundamental problem is that the country is cored out on multiple levels and is continuing to be cored out. Almost all the manufacturing is long gone except for defense related work. Once that was done they went after the white collar workers. The IT people were the most visible sign of this but they have gone after accounting, finance and HR as well.

But than we have the grand finale - lets continue to bring more and more people into the country while the number of jobs decreases.

It *almost* makes me want to vote for Trump, but IMO the bad outweighs the good.  Maybe someone else will turn up I can vote for -- on either side.

Trump is the only candidate that is talking about bringing jobs back to America, nationalism, and controlling our immigration and visa programs.  Sure, he has a big mouth and people associate him with the entertainment industry, but he is brilliant businessman.  I think when he comes out with his plans for the country, people will have a very different opinion of him.

Could we do any worse than Obama or Bush?  Trump has a big, bold approach to things and IMO, that is what it will take to bring America back.

For years, STEM workers in this country have been overlooked in favor of foreign workers.  It really didn't have to be this way, but our business as usual politicians, controlled by corporations and outside money, have sold the people of this country out via free trade agreements.  Trump is the only candidate that talks about that.  The other ones wouldn't dare because they'd pi$$ off their donors or they don't have a clue.

Our government gave the prosperity of this nation away over the past 20 years and its time to take it back.  I think Trump would do that with no apologies. 

David Randolph

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #13 on: September 04, 2015, 04:58:05 AM »
Trump is the only candidate that is talking about bringing jobs back to America, nationalism, and controlling our immigration and visa programs. Our government gave the prosperity of this nation away over the past 20 years and its time to take it back.  I think Trump would do that with no apologies.

Dream on. He will have as much impact as King Canute did over the tide https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_Canute_and_the_waves. He will have a bankrupt government trying to stop the flow of trillions of dollars.

About the only way he will have is to take us to war.

choppedwood

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Re: The STEM scam
« Reply #14 on: September 04, 2015, 06:08:18 AM »
[quote author=JoFrance link=topic=12314.msg83877#msg83877 date=1441327638
Trump is the only candidate that is talking about bringing jobs back to America, nationalism, and controlling our immigration and visa programs.  Sure, he has a big mouth and people associate him with the entertainment industry, but he is brilliant businessman.[/quote]

I don't have a link but some guy took a look at the money Trump received via inheritance, or however he got his start (it wasn't seat of the pants), and compared  investing that to what he made as a businessman.  Basically, he would have been better off doing nothing but indexing his money, maybe billions better, depending on what his actual wealth is.

I say this a lot but business success at the CEO level usually consists of "fearless leadership in the good times and, well, the economy drug my performance down in the bad times".  Or, my other favorite, "profits are up due to my new initiatives, wait, we got caught breaking the law, the only way my initiatives could succeed, well, no, I had no idea that was happening even though I'm the great leader if we hadn't gotten caught."

http://www.nationaljournal.com/twentysixteen/2015/09/02/1-easy-way-donald-trump-could-have-been-even-richer-doing-nothing